YVR-HKG also gets the frequency cut - Cathay Pacific - Hong Kong's Flag Carrier - Page 22 - SkyscraperCity - zjsk.com

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YVR-HKG also gets the frequency cut

YVR-HKG also gets the frequency cut
Published by: rose 2009-01-08

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Cathay Pacific - Hong Kong's Flag Carrier - Page 22 - SkyscraperCity::
And what happens if the flight that favours the business travellers the most gets too full? CX is now also tapping the India-US market.
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=343293&page=22HOME

Effective 26OCT08, Vancouver - Hong Kong will be reduced to 5 weekly for 2008/09 Winter season.

It'll not operate on Mon/Wed for Vancouver departure.

NOTE. The cut is effective until 10DEC08 only
(edited: 15AUG08)

Rumours abound that YYZ-NRT will be suspended for the winter schedule. Hope that they turn out to be false.

AC and the Asia-Canada routes are a MESS!
Fares (M and U) as well as flight freq from Japan, Korea, HKG etc.

Get it together AC!!!

Got it together, dude.
Just watched the value of the SWU drop from an Elite or SE perk to toilet paper.
Not so. When you are made to believe that you have a chance to get upgraded with a M or U fare (was not meant to be a full fare like Y)

Interesting that Y, M and U fares are now the same price as a C class ticket...
So, what is the value of the Y M or U SWU cert again???

Just buy a biz class fare - C fare - as economy Y M and U are the same price!

And you see nothing wrong with this???

Maybe you need to get it together and look how the SWU has lost its meaning as an EARNED perk with AP.

The difference in price of various fare types is never a consideration with AC. This is demonstrated by the fact that exactly the same no. of Status Miles are being awarded to those travelling in C, Z, Y, M, U, H, B, V, Q, A, P..... etc. AC does not appreciate that those flying in C, Z, Y, M and U are more "profitable" than those on V, Q, A, P, etc. Even J gets only a lousy 25% COS.

Some SE's spent less than E and some E spent less than P and some none status sepnt more than P. Flying fully J NRT/YYZ vs. some bottom feeders doing MR on the same route on some cheap discount economy tickets is a classical example. I hope one day AC will give better recognition to those who fly in higher fares. Even Via Rail awards miles based on $$ spent.

Back to original topic of the thread, is it an indication that CX has a greater market share on the YVR/HKG route than AC still with 17 flights/week after the reduction vs. AC's 5, not even daily service?

The difference in price of various fare types is never a consideration with AC. This is demonstrated by the fact that exactly the same no. of Status Miles are being awarded to those travelling in C, Z, Y, M, U, H, B, V, Q, A, P..... etc. AC does not appreciate that those flying in C, Z, Y, M and U are more "profitable" than those on V, Q, A, P, etc. Even J gets only a lousy 25% COS.

Since when did C and Z get the same number of status miles as <=Y? You might want to check your facts on that.

Back to original topic of the thread, is it an indication that CX has a greater market share on the YVR/HKG route than AC still with 17 flights/week after the reduction vs. AC's 5, not even daily service?

Document::
CX increased frequency. from 14 to 17 weekly. flights; by 30 Mar to 21. flights on YVR/HKG. route; effective 1 Feb. from 7 to 10 flights on. YYZ/HKG route
http://partnernet.hktb.com/pnweb/jsp/doc/listDoc.jsp?charset=en&doc_id=108414HOME

If you think within a box you might immediately come up such a conclusion.

But if you think of it more broadly, you might come up with a dfiferent answer. Or the answer might still be the same, but at least you take other things into consideration.

good thing you would not bet, because you would be wrong again.:rolleyes:

Is he? I seem to remember the Japanese government spanking FedEx for using one of it's slots to run a Cessna to some secondary airport in Japan for no other commercial reason than to keep the slot. I believe the government felt the slot could be put to better use. This was several years ago and I'm not sure what became of the threat.

What ROUTES will AC cut, post your guess. - FlyerTalk Forums::
You guys still don't get it..lol this is NOT about routes etc..this is all about to reduce frequency on routes that have extremely high frequencies.
http://web1.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan/835410-what-routes-will-ac-cut-post-your-guess.htmlHOME

YVR-HKG also gets the frequency cut - Page 2 - FlyerTalk Forums::
YVR-HKG also gets the frequency cut YVR-HKG also gets the frequency cut Also , don't you see what all airlines are doing in the Asian market?
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan/843507-yvr-hkg-also-gets-frequency-cut-2.htmlHOME

Is it your assertion that AC could suspend the YYZ/NRT service for the winter and not suffer any commercial repercussions?

Hello,

I'm new to flyertalk... I was originally booked on AC8 on Dec. 5, 2008. I noticed that AC has changed my booking to leave HKG on Dec 4 now. I'm also flying AC34 from YVR-YYZ on Dec 8.

Will AC permit me to change the dates/times of these two flights free of charge given that they cut AC8 on Dec. 5?

Thanks!

You should have complete flexibility since they made the change not you. Look at the schedule of all flights in and around that time and decide which flights you actual want and then call AC and tell you noticed that your flight has been changed and that the new time is not convenient for you. Assuming there is space on the flights you want and it is a reasonable routing, they will move you without cost.

good thing you would not bet, because you would be wrong again.:rolleyes:

Whew glad FA's are not running the show:D

Oh Revered Master of the Universe. Why do you think amidst all of the cuts AC is maintaining 4 flights a day through the winter YYZ-LHR?? Certainly they could short term lease out the slots, but having control over those slots is probably more valuable at the end of the day. Why do you think YVR picked up the missing daily YYZ frequencies to NRT last winter. Do you really think they (YVR) needed 10/11 weekly flights?? This info from one of the Route Managers, but what would they know?

Whew, whoa, hubba-hubba - glad not to be running the show. I know my proper place in life. Just a coffee-pouring, cookie-baking (when we're not hiding them from the customers), PTV-resetting kind of guy.

Back to original topic of the thread, is it an indication that CX has a greater market share on the YVR/HKG route than AC still with 17 flights/week after the reduction vs. AC's 5, not even daily service?

Wouldn't this have been clear for years when CX was 3 daily ex-YVR and AC was only daily? Although how many of CX's passengers were connecting to other destinations that AC serves non-stop from YVR.

Another way to look at it is AC's capacity cuts are actually less on an ASM basis than CX's and that isn't even considering the aircraft up gauge to the 77W.

Wouldn't bet on that one. Similar to LHR, slots are coveted positions and believe these two airport have a "use it or lose it" policy. That's why when YYZ-NRT was reduced to 3 flights last winter, YVR-NRT picked up the remaining 4 frequencies (albeit on a 763). Think even though it may operate with marginal revenue, YYZ-NRT is in better shape than YVR-Japan flights, and thus they will keep the daily frequency.

"Oh Revered Master of the Universe" Wrong again, perhaps we should discuss FA 24 hr rest in HKG, or why the 333 have pilot time limits on flights.:p

Since when did C and Z get the same number of status miles as <=Y? You might want to check your facts on that.

According to Andrew's FAQ (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=262475&postcount=3), on Asian routes J gets 125% status miles. Every other fare class (except D, W X and K) earns 100% status miles. Or have I misunderstood your point?

Good news for Cathay Pacific :D

Got it together, dude.
Just watched the value of the SWU drop from an Elite or SE perk to toilet paper.
Not so. When you are made to believe that you have a chance to get upgraded with a M or U fare (was not meant to be a full fare like Y)

Interesting that Y, M and U fares are now the same price as a C class ticket...
So, what is the value of the Y M or U SWU cert again???

Just buy a biz class fare - C fare - as economy Y M and U are the same price!

And you see nothing wrong with this???

Maybe you need to get it together and look how the SWU has lost its meaning as an EARNED perk with AP.

Y, M, U fares are generally flexible, changeable, and refundable. Z fares are definitely not. Z fares have a minimum advance purchase requirement (30 days I've seen on most) and have significant penalities to change or cancel. And if you change, you're likely to pay a fare upgrade because the Z bucket will be zeroed out.

So what's the value of a Y, M, U fare over a Z fare? Y, M, U are much more flexible than Z, a discounted C fare, which by the way, is also a discounted J fare.

There is nothing wrong with this. You don't have to play AC's game. No one is forcing you to especially in this market-based society and economy. Vote with your wallet as they say.

But also let us know if you're able to do anything like this on an Asian carrier.

Get over it -- the perk is just a perk. It's a benefit. It's not a right. Airlines are businesses, not a charity (more debatable if they are government owned or subsidized).

So it looks like I have it more together than you.

Good news for Cathay Pacific :DWho have also reduced their frequency; again !

"Effective 16SEP08, Hong Kong - Vancouver will be reduced to 17 weekly (CX836/835 back to 3 weekly). Original plan called for eff 26OCT08"

As long as it is actually a 777 I will be happy.

YVR-HKG frequencies have shocked me for some time. I wouldn't be surprised if further cuts are made to this route (not by AC of course.)

I note, also, that AC has not made any cuts to its Toronto-Asia services where it has less competition.

Rumours abound that YYZ-NRT will be suspended for the winter schedule. Hope that they turn out to be false.

GB, CX are cutting to 2x daily for the winter schedule (thread (http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=825934)).

What a massive loss of capacity on the route with CX cutting one flight, AC going less than daily and O8 just going.

Maybe it's simply a question of all carriers bringing capacity in line with demand after a bout of market share suicide attacks. For AC, it also allows it to use the larger and more cost-effective 777. I note, also, that AC has not made any cuts to its Toronto-Asia services where it has less competition.

Good news for Cathay Pacific :D

And theire double daily + sometimes 3rd option too !

Ok you're right. I'll take that comment back.

Upgrading from Y to J is a benefit (that you pay for). It is not a right. I don't see "Thou shalt upgrade to J when buying AC M and U tickets in any commandment or bible".

Also, don't you see what all airlines are doing in the Asian market? I see JL is cutting back flts ex-NRT to different parts of the world. CX is cutting back ex-HKG services. American carriers doing the same. European doing the same.

So AC is not alone.

Get it together bibu!!!

Got it together, dude.
Just watched the value of the SWU drop from an Elite or SE perk to toilet paper.
Not so. When you are made to believe that you have a chance to get upgraded with a M or U fare (was not meant to be a full fare like Y)

Interesting that Y, M and U fares are now the same price as a C class ticket...
So, what is the value of the Y M or U SWU cert again???

Just buy a biz class fare - C fare - as economy Y M and U are the same price!

And you see nothing wrong with this???

Maybe you need to get it together and look how the SWU has lost its meaning as an EARNED perk with AP.

Who is going to use AC slots?

Good grief. What next?

Since when did C and Z get the same number of status miles as <=Y? You might want to check your facts on that.

Clipper801's comment is correct according to the "Flights to all other destinations" (http://www.aeroplan.com/earn_miles/our_partners/partner_details.do?Partner=AirCanada) portion of the Aeroplan website for AC.

AC appears to be shortened the period of the cut, it'll go back to Daily from 11DEC08

Thanks for the advice!

CX will be reducing (http://www.hkadb.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20030) YVR services down to 14x weekly recently this coming winter schedule so there won't be 3x daily services on any day of the week.

Things doesn't seem to bode well on the Canada-HK market. Oasis bursting into thin air led to the loss of their HKG-YVR, then CX followed with the reduction of 21x-17x weekly on YVR, then followed with the reduction of 10x-7x weekly on YYZ, then continued its added reduction on YVR down to 14x weekly and now AC is cutting 2 flights per week as per this thread.

Wouldn't bet on that one. Similar to LHR, slots are coveted positions and believe these two airport have a "use it or lose it" policy. That's why when YYZ-NRT was reduced to 3 flights last winter, YVR-NRT picked up the remaining 4 frequencies (albeit on a 763). Think even though it may operate with marginal revenue, YYZ-NRT is in better shape than YVR-Japan flights, and thus they will keep the daily frequency.

good thing you would not bet, because you would be wrong again.:rolleyes:

Whew glad FA's are not running the show:D

Is he? I seem to remember the Japanese government spanking FedEx for using one of it's slots to run a Cessna to some secondary airport in Japan for no other commercial reason than to keep the slot. I believe the government felt the slot could be put to better use. This was several years ago and I'm not sure what became of the threat.

Is it your assertion that AC could suspend the YYZ/NRT service for the winter and not suffer any commercial repercussions?

No I never said that>????? YYZ-SYD thinks YYZ-NRT is safe from CUTS. :D he got his info from route control.

Any cuts will create AC commercial repercussions:rolleyes: however not cutting will also create commercial repercussions. "damed of you do damed if you don't'

Also at $150 oil, and a recession Japan is cutting flights:eek:

Rumours abound that YYZ-NRT will be suspended for the winter schedule. Hope that they turn out to be false.

Wouldn't bet on that one. Similar to LHR, slots are coveted positions and believe these two airport have a "use it or lose it" policy. That's why when YYZ-NRT was reduced to 3 flights last winter, YVR-NRT picked up the remaining 4 frequencies (albeit on a 763). Think even though it may operate with marginal revenue, YYZ-NRT is in better shape than YVR-Japan flights, and thus they will keep the daily frequency.

I wonder if it's more a question of yields than demand. We all know that there are tonnes of great airfares to Asia via consolidators, so maybe this is an attempt to cut reliance on those to fill the back cabin.

Oh Revered Master of the Universe. Why do you think amidst all of the cuts AC is maintaining 4 flights a day through the winter YYZ-LHR?? Certainly they could short term lease out the slots, but having control over those slots is probably more valuable at the end of the day. Why do you think YVR picked up the missing daily YYZ frequencies to NRT last winter. Do you really think they (YVR) needed 10/11 weekly flights?? This info from one of the Route Managers, but what would they know?

Well that route controller should go back to his information source to double check. Or he needs to find a new source.

By the way, operating slots instead of leasing them out is not always more lucrative...

Who have also reduced their frequency; again !

"Effective 16SEP08, Hong Kong - Vancouver will be reduced to 17 weekly (CX836/835 back to 3 weekly). Original plan called for eff 26OCT08"

Double daily and on certain days, a 3rd choice.

.

Back to original topic of the thread, is it an indication that CX has a greater market share on the YVR/HKG route than AC still with 17 flights/week after the reduction vs. AC's 5, not even daily service?

WOW you complained for 6 months AC didnt have a 777 on the route now its going to be there... and its not enough.:eek: With the extra seats of the 777 maybe its the same capacity as the 340:D:D

Oh Revered Master of the Universe. Why do you think amidst all of the cuts AC is maintaining 4 flights a day through the winter YYZ-LHR?? Certainly they could short term lease out the slots, but having control over those slots is probably more valuable at the end of the day. Why do you think YVR picked up the missing daily YYZ frequencies to NRT last winter. Do you really think they (YVR) needed 10/11 weekly flights?? This info from one of the Route Managers, but what would they know?

Whew, whoa, hubba-hubba - glad not to be running the show. I know my proper place in life. Just a coffee-pouring, cookie-baking (when we're not hiding them from the customers), PTV-resetting kind of guy.

Only time will tell who is the 'revered master of the universe" did you want to bet>:cool: